A haplogroup and a patriarch for the Rothiemay Lobbans (revised, March 2020)
New DNA results allow us to connect several family trees
- [new] The haplotype subgroup for the Rothiemay area Lobbans has been changed to R-FT14993 because R-BY227100 (now called Banffshire Lobbans) now contains two branches, the other being the Marnoch Lobbans.
- The haplogroup links descendants of the Knabbygates and Boginspro families.
- From paper records, the earliest known ancestor in this branch appears to be Andrew Loban, born about 1590 in the Rothiemay area.
- All the Lobbans living in Rothiemay in the late 1600s were his descendants, implying that most if not all of those living there after the gap in parish records (1710-1748) are also related.
- We are confident that the Loanend family line is part of this tree, as it has a known common ancestor with the Boginspro line; a DNA test is in progress.
- The “William & Bathia” tree also starts from this earliest ancestor, as shown by paper records.
- [new] The Marnoch families are genetically part of the Banffshire Lobbans, but ancestral to the Rothiemay Area Lobbans.
- We expect that other family trees may turn out to be part of this haplogroup.
- Summary of descendant lines; composite tree, and pdf of descendants chart available .
The following argument by Chris S. Lobban for the origin and structure of the Rothiemay area haplogroup is based on a list of Scottish baptisms and marriages compiled by Stephanie Logan Falls, the set of family trees constructed by Sydney Lobban, and the Y-DNA analysis carried out by John Sloan.
New DNA evidence connects Boginspro and Knabbygates lines
Y-700 DNA results from donor #7, a descendant of John Lobban (1777–1869) of Boginspro (tree), show that there is a close relationship between this donor and #1 (myself) of the Knabbygates line (tree). We share one ancestral marker SNP variant, 25953682 G to A that defines the haplogroup. The two lines are distinguished by the presence of distinct markers: #7 has at least two, #1 has one, as shown in the diagram below. Also marked on that diagram is the known relationship between the families at Loanend and Boginspro, two nearby farms that in parish days were in the northern part of Huntly, close to Rothiemay (map below). The most recent common ancestor between them is William Lobban (1717– ) of Drumblade, whose son Robert Lobban (1748– ) settled Loanend, and grandson John settled Boginspro (diagram below).
Evidence for the connection between the Boginspro line and Andrew Loban line
At the top of the family tree above, the earliest known ancestor for the Loanend and Boginspro lines in Syd Lobban’s Drumblade & Loanend Kinnoir tree is John, baptized 18 Jan 1685. The name of the farm is illegible in the parish record. This person also appears in Syd’s Rothiemay & Rathven tree, as the great grandson of Andrew Loban, b. 1590 in the Rothiemay area, who is thus the earliest known ancestor for donor #7.
We know very little about Andrew Loban. He was born in the Rothiemay area about 1590 and married Janet Loban (was this her maiden surname?). The IGI Index (refers to FHL film numbers 0991194 and 0991195 but I could not find it on the films; it is probably on the latter but very hard to read the handwriting) records the marriage in 1610 of Androw [sic] Loban & Janet Loban. However Rudge’s transcriptions of OPR marriages (his p. 67; pdf here) give a proclamation date of 3 Dec. 1611, and the text as “Andrew Loban and Jannet Loban proclaimed,” and speculates that they might have been cousins. This record is not in the electronic database at ScotlandsPeople. I will take Rudge’s record as accurate, since he evidently saw the record and could read the old writing. Rudge’s early Lobbans chart comments that Andrew was “noted at Grange in 1628” (source not located). We know of only one son, Alexander (b. about 1630, possibly Rothiemay), known from the baptism record of his son James 1660; his other sons were born 1655–1662, from which his d.o.b. seems to have been inferred. Alexander gave him the five grandsons listed below, but it is likely that there were other sons—and daughters, of course, especially given the long period between Andrew’s marriage and Alexander’s birth. However, I have not yet seen any evidence to connect Andrew to Alexander. Even if the person at the top of the tree is not Andrew, the structure of the proposed branches is unaffected. Ancestry search also finds an Andrew Loban, son of Alexander, baptized in Grange 7 Dec 1684, who does not appear in Syd’s trees or ScotlandsPeople.
Evidence for the connections between the Rothiemay Lobbans before and after the gap in records
I listed the families inhabiting Rothiemay Parish in the half-century before the gap in records, i.e. 1660–1710, and discovered that all except one had earliest ancestor Andrew Loban; indeed the fathers in these families are the five grandsons of Andrew, via his one known son, Alexander. The exception, at the end of the list, includes the Knabbygates earliest known ancestor, William Lobban (1680– ). Here is the list [I have retained the spelling Loban as used in those days, but as noted elsewhere in this web, in the 18th C. the spelling became erratic and finally settled on Lobban.] —
- William Loban (1655, Rothiemay) & Elspet George: boys incl. John (1679, Quoir Mayen, Rothiemay) and William (1688, Mayen, Rothiemay). This family’s descendants include the William & Bathia tree members.
- George Loban (1659, Rothiemay), m. Janet Adam at Corskellie farm, Rothiemay; boys John and George (both baptisms in 1684; puzzle here).
- John Loban (1658, Rothiemay) & Isobel Davidson (m. 1680) several different locations in Rothiemay: boys George (1679, Kirton), James (1683, Kirton), John (1685, Ternemny), Alexander (1693, Retanach)
- James Loban (b. 1660 in Rothiemay), m. Margaret Pittendriech (b. 1665, Rothiemay); boys: John (1685, Rothiemay), James 1691 (Forgue parish, as were most of the girls). James married in Rothiemay and stayed there for the birth of their first two children, then went back to Forgue. John-1685 is the connection to the Loanend/Boginspro lines.
- Alexander Loban (1662, Rothiemay) m. Janet Elice: four children all at Ternemny 1683-1702, including boys James (1683) and John (1702).
The above five are the grandchildren of Andrew Loban.
- William Loban (1680) & Isobel Adam, Ternemny Farm with brothers Alex and John and their unknown spouses. Wm & Isobel moved to Knabbygates 1704 after son Alex 1702 was born. Although some ancestors have been proposed for them I do not consider them reliable.
So, the implication from DNA is that Andrew Loban 1590 might be the common ancestor for both the Loanend/Boginspro line and Knabbygates. I am going to take this as a working hypothesis, with the caveat that the connection could be a generation earlier or later. As noted above, the William & Bathia tree also connects to this line. Moreover, the fact that Alexander had 5 sons and Andrew apparently only one is a reminder that the records at this date are far from complete, and it is likely that Andrew had more sons. I first postulate a plausible connection of the Knabbygates line at one of these unknown sons, as shown in the tree below, and second anticipate that other branches of Lobbans will one day be connected to this haplogroup, given the potential number of additional sons/grandsons of Andrew.
Orphaned Lobban families in Rothiemay, after the gap in records
According to the New Statistical Account of Scotland (1845, reference below), “There is a blank in the baptismal registers from 30th July 1710 till 1748, and in the marriage registers from 22nd July 1707 till the year 1750.” The problem with this long gap in records (about 38 years) is that family trees leading to Rothiemay stop short of connecting to each other. Following the gap in parish records, there were Lobbans living in at least 12 places in Rothiemay (marked with red boxes on map below).
However, if all the people in Rothiemay before the gap are now shown to be related, then most of the families present after the gap must also be connected back to Andrew. Many of the families, derived from records of baptisms, consist of snippets with parents and one or more children, but no further lines of descent. Sydney has such a group in his “Alex & Ann Lobban Rothiemay” fragment, and four baptisms in his “Katie (Marnoch)” tree occurred in Rothiemay. There is also for Huntly (St. Margaret’s Parish) from Alan Rudge’s book (pp. 65-66) baptisms of four children during 1754 to 1761 to Lewis Loban and Helen Grant, and Lewis’ death by apoplexy in 1769, but of these events only the death is in Scotland’sPeople. We have no further records of this family. Rudge also lists six children born to George Loban and May Garden during 1763 to 1775 from the same records; again these do not appear online.
The only other major line that has connections with Rothiemay is the Marnoch Area Lobbans, starting from William Lobban (1732, Kinnairdy, Marnoch) and Margaret Reburn, which I have described separately; they are also in Syd’s Rothiemay & Rathven tree. As shown in the families distribution map, baptisms in this family account for 19% of those for the parish in Syd’s Collection, compared to 67% for Rothiemay Area Lobbans, so some of the orphaned families may belong to this group. This branch has now (March 2020) been shown to be ancestral to the Rothiemay Area Lobbans haplogroup, within the Banffshire haplogroup.
In addition, the John Lobban (abt. 1730)=Christian Forbes tree is almost certainly part of this group, as John was born about 1730 in Rothiemay–the date and origin of John deduced from his son William Lobban‘s baptism record (b. 1759, Swell of Mayen, Rothiemay). (See Catalog notes.)
Search for a test marker for BY227100 or FT14993
We had hoped that the shared marker could be used for a specific test for this group, but by bad luck the base sequence around the marker is identical to another fragment of Y-DNA, so that any hook (technically, a primer) that could pull out our marker would also pull out the other fragment, giving false positives. Even with additional test results that is still the case as of March 2020.
- Summary of families in descendants of Andrew Loban
- Detailed account of Knabbygates: William Lobban (abt 1680– )
- Account of the Marnoch Lobbans
Background information on Rothiemay in the [Old] Statistical Account of Scotland, vol. 19, pp. 385–393 (1797) and the New Statistical Account, vol. 13, pp. 199–203 (1845). (Links are to the index pages for each entire work.)
Page created by C. Lobban 25 July 2018, completely rewritten 4 Mar 2019, last updated 23 Mar. 2020.